Shooting in a school in Scotland

[ovenpaa]

Consider this as a scenario.

Lets de-restrict firearms for one year, so anyone over the age of 18 can legally own a firearm without a licence up to say .32 calibre including S/A. No questions asked, after all you can legally vote, get married, have children and even die for your country, so why not own a firearm as well? You could always add the proviso that says you must have a driving licence in order to buy one.

Great, well the police will not have to worry about looking for illegal firearms as they will mostly be legal, so less work them also the FEO will have an easy life as they will only be dealing with shotguns and anyway come year two they could be de-restricted a well.

End of year one, would shootings have gone up or down? We can then compare the numbers against the shootings that did happen, bit of math and we have a number for the "Shootings that didn’t happen"

[Robin128]

Consider this...how old was the lad that went shooting in that secondary school today...under 18?...then he is already banned. Yet, the law didn't stop him, nor did the police.

And no matter how one fools around with logic...no-one can quantify what didn't happen...ie the shootings that didn't happen in the same period...and I read a few books on hard sums.

No-one got killed, did they?

[ovenpaa]

Not checked the news since I got home, so they have caught a kid then?

No-one got killed, did they?

That makes it all OK then?

[Sandgroper]

Not checked the news since I got home, so they have caught a kid then?

No-one got killed, did they?

That makes it all OK then?

An 18 and 15 year old are being questioned by the Police.

Ovenpaa,
I understand what you are saying about licensing, but how are you going to achieve it? Nobody knows how many air guns are in the UK, they can only give estimates. Only the law abiding shooter will register his/her air gun/s.

Another way to put it is how many air guns have I got? I could have one or I could have ten. You are relying on my honesty and integrity to license my air guns.

[ovenpaa]

I understand what you are saying about licensing, but how are you going to achieve it? Nobody knows how many air guns are in the UK, they can only give estimates. Only the law abiding shooter will register his/her air gun/s.

Another way to put it is how many air guns have I got? I could have one or I could have ten. You are relying on my honesty and integrity to license my air guns.

It was done with firearms so it can also be done with air guns, a good start would be licensing all commercial sales of new and used. It can be done.

[Sandgroper]

It was done with firearms so it can also be done with air guns, a good start would be licensing all commercial sales of new and used. It can be done.

True it could be done with new sales, but how do you license the 4 Million or so currently in circulation?

[Dangermouse]

I agree with Ovenpaa on this one, and not because I am a Police Officer and have some wish to see everything licensed.

As a shooter with children, I hope some day to let my children have a choice as to if they wish to take the sport up or not.
As previously mentioned air gun crimes are included with firearm crimes. These include all the summer holiday kids who get bored and accidentaly cause an accident, or break a window. Not just the idiots who use them maliciously or with criminal intention.
Not surprisingly these figures give an artificialy high figure when looked at and reflect badly on all shooting disciplines.

I have dealt with several cheap air guns where by the users would never have had their hands on them had they had to go through any kind of paper trail. I have never seen an air gun of any real value used by these morons, they tend to get their hands on cheap Chinese style break barrel guns, which in the past were sold by shops with no interest in the future of shooting and had nothing to do with the sport.

So I disagree with those who wail and gnash their teeth, shouting "big brother" etc, I see it as a sensible way to prolong the shooting sports that we still have left.

DM

[Dangermouse]

Our old foe actually provides some interesting details

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF05.htm

At the bottom of the page you will see a link to the Scottish figures.

Not sure if these figures have been manipulated by them or if they show the as they are reported by the Home Office,

To support the argument for not letting the status Quo continue, you can see quite a dramatic fall in air gun figures since the Violent Crime reduction Act 2006 came in to force. Now less than half what it was 5 years back.

DM

[Robin128]

Not checked the news since I got home, so they have caught a kid then?

No-one got killed, did they?

That makes it all OK then?

Agreed it's not ok but I really don't think licensing and banning airguns is appropriate...it's an over reaction IMHO. If we could Police the law more might help. NB 500,000 airguns in Scotland...who will own up to having them? Only the already legal and law abiding citizens. Scum will hold onto them.

And I've never been for rolling out s1 weapons to all and sundry...and I've made that clear on here and GT over the last 5 years. :)

Someone getting a pellet in the ar$e is a bit different from someone taking a 12G in the face....again IMHO. Not having a go...I wish I knew what the answer was David...totally unconvinced that a banning or law change, other than what already exists will make a difference.

:)

[Sandgroper]

I have dealt with several cheap air guns where by the users would never have had their hands on them had they had to go through any kind of paper trail. I have never seen an air gun of any real value used by these morons, they tend to get their hands on cheap Chinese style break barrel guns, which in the past were sold by shops with no interest in the future of shooting and had nothing to do with the sport.

I don't disagree with anything either you or Ovenpaa have said. It's easy enough to say license them, but no-one says how this would/could be done.

As far as the cheap chinese ones are concerned, you're right - they the air guns of choice for these yobs. I suppose one way of controlling these cheap airguns is to up the price by way of a tariff (a minimum price)to make them less attractive.

We then come back to, how to get the ones that are in the wrong hands out of circulation.