The UK's Finest Independent Forum for Shooters and Gun Owners. Est 2010.

Even the BBC are getting in on the act...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-44053904

"Those that end up on the black market often start off as legal guns - but become illegal because they are modified or their licence status changes."

... so making it sound like the majority of guns on the streets are stolen from FAC holders...

The late Colin Greenwood used to rubbish this argument from officials, police officers and politicians - ie that somehow the legitimate guntrade and individual owners were to blame. As he pointed out, short of a handful of really crude weapons manufactured in backstreet workshops usually for political insurgents, by definition EVERY weapon started life as a legal one, moreover mostly commissioned by and paid for by governments or governmental organisations.

Baader-Meinhof / Red Army Faction was largely armed from Bundeswehr weapons stolen from government armouries. How many police owned weapons have ended up in criminal hands?

It is as logical to try to stop up the supply of 'illegal weapons' by banning private ownership as it would be try to do so by disarming the armed forces and police.

(.... and before anybody says that unlike the Bundeswehr, our forces never lose weapons, well they do! The British Army 'lost' an SA80 at Strensall Ranges just down the road from York some years back - never recovered! There is also the issue of illegal souvenirs brought back from wars despite strict checks, controls and dire punishments if caught. I saw an estimate as to how many illegal pieces came into the country after the relatively small Falklands War and it was surprisingly large - the Ballister Molina Hafdasha copy of the 45 Colt 1911 was a particularly popular souvenir and quite a number have since turned up in 'incidents', seizures or amnesties.)

When I read this biased so called journalism i wonder who is the driving force behind the story ??

Did you spot the reference to imitation firearms with the very small explanatory note?

really annoying.

Blackstuff wrote:Reading through it, its pretty hard not to get the impression that our fates are in the hands of people who have absolutely no idea what they're talking about, all the while being 'guided' by people with an obvious agenda which is contrary to our interests.

Yep...........

Daryll wrote:Even the BBC are getting in on the act...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-44053904

"Those that end up on the black market often start off as legal guns - but become illegal because they are modified or their licence status changes."

... so making it sound like the majority of guns on the streets are stolen from FAC holders...

Scroll down to the bar chart showing offences commited with different types of guns. Right at the top 'Handguns', right at the bottom 'Rifles', of which .50cals and MARS/lever-release form a minute percentage of. How can the utter lack of logic in the proposals be ignored?! (Rhetorical question!)

Laurie wrote: (.... and before anybody says that unlike the Bundeswehr, our forces never lose weapons, well they do! The British Army 'lost' an SA80 at Strensall Ranges just down the road from York some years back - never recovered!

Not just one SA80 Laurie. Do you remember an article in the press a few years back listing the number of firearms lost by the forces and various police forces in recent years. I believe that the information may have been as a result of a freedom of information request. The artricle was published around the time that a female close protection officer left her pistol in the toilets of Macdonalds and it was returned by a member of the public.


Personally I can recall visiting the armoury of a T.A. unit some years ago and a recruit reporting the loss of a rifle. The potential recruit for this unit was on a selection march and had sat down in a hollow somewhere in the Brecon Beacons range and had got up and walked away forgetting his rifle. A search later that night and the following morning failed to find the rifle, so they were going back to give it another look two days later. I wonder if that one ever turned up.

"Over 300" 2006-2011 (only 39 recovered)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... found.html

We were up in Brecon one weekend and bumped into a white faced Captain who'd misplaced his rifle. He was going for selection at the time as well.....

Rockhopper wrote:We were up in Brecon one weekend and bumped into a white faced Captain who'd misplaced his rifle. He was going for selection at the time as well.....

My late father joined a cavalry regiment at the start of WW2 and on the way back from a tank practice session their train stopped for refreshments. He left his service revolver and ammunition on the luggage rack and when he got back on they were gone. He was summoned before the CO, given a lecture about IRA terrorists and told that he would likely be court martialled. Fortunately the next day his regiment was called up and he went on to fight with the Desert Rats, rising to the rank of Major.

I have finally had a reply from the local Labour MP* after sending an e-mail on 26th June ... and a link to the progression of the consultation.
(* I'd never vote Labour).

https://services.parliament.uk/Bills/20 ... apons.html

And the text of the e-mail:

Dear **

Thank you for contacting me about proposed changes to firearms laws.

As you are aware, following a consultation on offensive and dangerous weapons, the Government has now introduced the Offensive Weapons Bill to strengthen the response to violent crime. The Bill includes a measure to ban .50 calibre rifles and rapid-firing rifles from civilian use. There is a compensation clause to provide for payments in respect of weapons surrendered.

I appreciate these proposals have provoked a strong response from the shooting community and I know concerns have been raised about the impact of these changes on those who currently use these firearms for legitimate purposes such as target shooting. However, the Government have noted the concerns raised around the potential for .50 calibre rifles and rapid firing rifles to be seriously misused and for loss of life to occur if they were to fall into the wrong hands. I note that the Government argues that its proposed measures are based on evidence from intelligence sources, police and other security experts and has also said that weapons of this type have been used in the Troubles in Northern Ireland and have been possessed by criminals who have clearly intended to use them.

There is clearly an urgent need to tackle violent crime and I therefore support the proposals on firearms. I do appreciate that this will be disappointing to hear given the position you have contacted me on however, the evidence submitted does suggest the urgent need for action to be taken.

The Offensive Weapons Bill will now be considered in a Public Bill Committee and the Government has indicated that it will listen to the concerns that have been raised by those who oppose the proposals on firearms and so hopefully the concerns you highlight will be considered fully at this stage. This stage is due to take place on 24 July and you can follow the progress at the Parliamentary website https://services.parliament.uk/Bills/20 ... apons.html

Thank you once again for contacting me and for sharing your views. I will bear in mind the points you have raised as this Bill progresses.

Yours sincerely